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Post by Osiris on Dec 22, 2015 9:38:33 GMT -8
OK, so I know the way AC is currently 'working' is very hackish - so I am in process of reconsidering/re-writing the way the 'hack' works. Over the next few days I will actually be changing up AC to work as a MOD, and not a hack. It will eventually work like AC is supposed to work, just modified for this environment.
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Post by sunbeam on Dec 23, 2015 4:16:38 GMT -8
Look I have a concern. AC might be too good. Seems like only the boss mobs can really threaten you after a while.
But if you changed it so 40 of Coirnav's buddies are something to worry about, the boss mobs might not be doable.
Wish other guys would chime in with their thoughts, because I'm not totally sure what I think about the whole thing.
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Post by squirtgunn on Dec 23, 2015 11:46:50 GMT -8
I agree with sunbeam. It could possibly use some adjusting, just don't make it so encounters like Coirnav are undoable because of the sheer number of mobs.
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Post by Osiris on Dec 23, 2015 12:15:45 GMT -8
Look I have a concern. AC might be too good. Seems like only the boss mobs can really threaten you after a while. I have always known some form of this to be true...the AC/mitigation 'mod' that has been in place since 6/1/15 was always a 'bandaid' fix from my point of view. Now that I have some time, and some better skills I thought I could make it better. But if you changed it so 40 of Coirnav's buddies are something to worry about, the boss mobs might not be doable. mitigation factors will be slightly different for some classes per this server policy (Str, WIS, INT, DEX, etc, ...). Sorry to be ambiguous with that statement, but I am taking into account that the goal is still to be able to kill bosses. AC/mitigation will not change per say, it will actually work better. You will be able to swap gear mid fight and see a difference, no longer will a mob just being swinging and missing without dealing any damage... Wish other guys would chime in with their thoughts, because I'm not totally sure what I think about the whole thing. its gonna be good...I think really good, but hey that's me---haha. I already have it (mitigation) working so much better on the testbox, you can actually see a difference as you take off gear mid-fight....put the gear back on mid-fight and see the difference restored. So the code structure is there and working, I am just playing around with how/what stats effect the mitigation. Also, its extremely fine-tunable, so the mititgation will be easily fine-tuned 'in-game.' The new AC/mitigation system should be live some time later this afternoon. (it will require a reboot) |
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Post by benolvole on Dec 25, 2015 14:03:42 GMT -8
after it has been put in place, i think it may need a little more twinking or looking at. I can barely kill Cynosure Kvanjji with 4.7k ac and +52 avoidance. Im not really seeing a huge difference with the armor as in reduced hits the more ac you have?? I like a little challenge but barely surviving mobs when you have the best possible armor in the game is pretty lame imo.
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Post by Osiris on Dec 25, 2015 21:43:51 GMT -8
just to clarify some things... ......I can barely kill Cynosure Kvanjji with 4.7k ac and +52 avoidance. Has this always been true? If you were able to kill him previously (before 12-23-15), is killing Cynosure now pretty much the same result? Im not really seeing a huge difference with the armor as in reduced hits the more ac you have??..... This is kinda the same question I already said, but would you say before and after the 12-23 mitigation changes you have seen little, or no change? |
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Post by benolvole on Dec 26, 2015 1:35:25 GMT -8
Actually no the fight before the changes was a cake walk, like i said i like challenge but with the best possible armor for my monk and barely able to kill him, imagine for people that are trying to get qvic armor, it could be a big pain but who knows.
And I see some changes indeed but often it feels like it isn't there, its hard to explain. the mobs will still hit for the amount that its suppose to and one hit after awhile will be greatly reduced as if the armor is there.
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Post by Osiris on Dec 26, 2015 7:35:32 GMT -8
I kinda 'eye-balled' the mitigation scale, but it was configured so I can make adjustments to scale effectiveness. I can make the mitigation more effective, that isnt a problem. However, ....
Without getting into specifics, its possible just scaling up the mitigation effect will be the solution. Or I might need to make some code modifications (which won't be a problem, and wont take that long to get implement.)
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Post by benolvole on Dec 26, 2015 13:40:19 GMT -8
Whatever you do, im not asking for it to be last time where everything is just dodged. Dont get me wrong i like the idea that you made with the ac, im just thinking from another stand point. I already have time and qvic armor, and having problems with qvic. How is someone going to clear it by themselves with only time gear? Not to mention i have 52 avoidance which increases my dodging tremendously.
It might sound like im complaining at this point, sorry for that, but with 30k hp getting hit for 2k each hit it starts to add up. Just my two cents, either way i still love the server
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Post by Osiris on Dec 26, 2015 21:25:53 GMT -8
I don't look at it as complaining at all...I see it as feedback, and valuable at that.
The 'new' mitigation system is definitely working as it was intended, however it appears that the 'effectiveness' needs to be adjusted. I could have scaled up the effectiveness, however I used this time to add some further granularity to the source code.
All of that is already done; I am now just going thru stats from (top 5-10) each player class and crunching some numbers to see that everything is calculating how I want it to.
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Post by kerrilea on Dec 27, 2015 12:38:46 GMT -8
I play with two others and together we have a Wiz, Druid, and SK. Last night, we had our butts handed to us repeatedly. I admit, before the changes it was too easy to kill anything we set our sights on, but last night really made us scratch our heads. The first dragon in TNoV wiped us. The hedge flag in PoNightmare almost wiped us (took out the druid due to a heal on the tank so I wasn't able to get flagged with the others). Vhaksiz the Shade wiped us (although, as the healer, I will take responsibility of that because I misjudged how much damage this guy would do now compared to before when I could tank him as a druid). Anyhow, I am wondering if this is how it's going to be on the server? It's certainly not "solo-able" as is... the three of us together are having issues trying to get past PoP tier 1. I also saw a 65 ranger in /ooc asking why he could no longer kill boss mobs. I agree with the above post by Benovole... a challenge is great and I love working on strategy when it comes to killing something but that's different from a brick wall that's impossible to get by without the original intended raid necessity from EQ live. I apologize if it sounds like I am complaining. I love this server so far and I know it's a lot of work. I just wanted to add what I have observed so far and ask if these are intended consequences or if adjustments are still in the works?
Thank you for the time you put into this. It really is appreciated!
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Post by Osiris on Dec 27, 2015 14:48:33 GMT -8
I'm sorry this happened...the current iteration will only be in effect for about 2 more hours. After that I will have a new version running where the game experience will be similar as it was before. I do apologize, the current condition of everyone being more squishy was never my intent.
I rewrote some stuff last night, and tested it this morning and found that it was NOT behaving the way I wanted it to. I'm almost done with the edit/update now, and should have it on the live server within 2 hours.
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Post by Osiris on Dec 27, 2015 15:01:02 GMT -8
just to state my intent here:
-previously the way melee mitigation was handled I was not happy with; what was in place was a Band-Aid fix
-I wanted to make mitigation scale in similar fashion as other functions do on this server like spells dps, melee dps, etc.
-the system was successfully re-done and no longer works as the 'Band-Aid' fix did.
-the goal was to make the re-write have similar results as the Band-Aid fix, but with the 'server-scaling' being the determining factor.
-currently, the scale-effectiveness is not providing "similar results" and is currently being worked on.
-the end result will have "similar results" as the band aid fix did, but will be working thru the 'new' mitigation system.
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Post by Osiris on Dec 27, 2015 15:06:42 GMT -8
Change of plan:
I am going to restore the "Band-Aid" fix. While I finish with my code re-writes. I should have the new system ready later this afternoon.
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Post by Osiris on Dec 27, 2015 15:11:28 GMT -8
server is now rebooting with the old melee (band-aid) system running.
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